ReMix:Terranigma "Reviving Zue" 3:38

Wow, I wouldn't know what category of music this would go under. Maybe jungle/electronic? It's certainly different to anything I've heard and I just love those slurring flutes and violin. I like it. I like it a lot.

Good remix, I really enjoyed it from the outset. One of my favourite features of it, I must say, is that it sounds so little like the source. 'Zue' is such a brilliant and distinctive track that remix it in too straight/faithful a fashion would probably have annoyed me. This one, however, works.

Awesome intro here. Love the vinyl scratching! Then out of nowhere, Ziwtra comes in with a crazy ethnic flute. Even though it caught me off guard at first, I quickly started to like it. THe guitar/synth part that follows is a great section that really drives. I love the breakbeat section after that too. I'm groovin' on the couch here and my wife is looking at me like I'm crazy (I have headphones on). The solo violin/viola was a really nice touch. Another great example of how Youngjin can take a lot of different styles and throw them all into one! Very impressive. The glitchy drums are excellent and I adore the sweeping pads! Awesome work!

Definitely captures the essence of the Zue (African plains) terranigma game. The upbeat high energy essence. I have to admit the guitar bit put it like in my ears like to be a tech type city area, which is cool.

Love it...

My ranting in this thread is pretty embarrassing...the only excuse I can think of, which is true, is that I was at the time, and still am, a Miyoko Kobayashi fanboy of stalker proportions. When Krale made his comment I was afraid if it went uncontested, people might read it, believe it and then end up thinking less of Mrs. Kobayashi.

Anyway, thanks to this song I was introduced to Zwitra who became EASILY one of my favorite remixers, I even recommended him to Gray as a potential judge. Really Solid Mix

Music snobbery at it's finest!

I've also gotta thank krale and Sam for the whole flamewar that happened here - that was one of the most violent (and therefore most fun) theory fights I've seen in quite some time.

I never heard the source so I can't join in (besides, it's 4 years old...), but I'll put my faith in Sam, on this one. Way to go! I've got to say, the way Sam handled this gives me more respect for him than I already did before (Chopan? lol)

Oh ya, great mix; very clean, very smooth. I like the instrumentation, in particular - the bass and violin are great!

Edit: I'll add that I commended you for the posts, Sam, because of how civil you were about the whole matter (compared to krale). It shows you are the better person

lolol, I never realized there were any flamewars going on for this mix until just now. I realize they were a couple years ago, but like, LOL

music snobbery at it's finest!

Over-analyst 1: Huff!

Over-analyst 2: Huff Puff!

Over-analyst 1: Huff Puff??! Huff, sir, huff!

Over-analyst 2: ???! Puffity Huff Puff! Braaaaawr!

Over-analyst 1: Bweee?? Huff huff huff! Pwaaaaaaaaf!

BTW, Sam is awesome

Connection to the source and ancient flamewars aside, this is a pretty good mix. Beats are great, and forcing it into 4 has given it a very cool melodic feel. I love the gates and the bassline.

Production is lofi, but solid, if not a bit treble heavy, though it all fits together well to let the textures shine.

Thematically, this remix stays true to the original themes of the song of focus and growth. Having a narrow melodic path to wind through, but a ton of energy, it really surges forward. I love the original, and I love this one too. Nice work Ziwtra.

I've had this song for a while, and I've always liked it quite a bit. After a few months of not hearing it once, I just turned the song on repeat and plugged in my good speakers for a few minutes. Great song! The flute (or whatever instrument that is, I haven't a clue) at 0:30 to about 1:00 sounds fantastic, I really like how you switched up the main instrument throughout the song. I also dig the shift between higher-energy to kind of elegant-sounding and then back at about 2 minutes.

Good stuff.

I've been familiar with a fair chunk of Ziwtra's work in the past, and even here I'm impressed with this mix. I can't say I'm too hot on Terranigma but it's cool to see some expansive coverage for the game score outside the countless Crysta mixes it has mainly spawned.

So yeah, it's about time I managed to catch onto a light write-up through listening to the mix, using the same analysis stylesheet that I adapted to as a Sonic Revolution judge.

Remix

This piece has its light familiarities to the source in terms of some of the melodic progressions to it, although I was hoping for a little bit more; nonetheless it's still got its progressive appeal upon much of the alterations taken to it. The time signature conversion was very good along with much of the liberalities that were taken on with some of the portions of the theme to help create a very thoughtful atmosphere to easily round off that aspect of the track. In terms of execution I managed to appreciate a good amount of this for what it was; much of it was very clean and well rounded to be able to take in all the way through, even for a song of this genre. The structuring was also good with the breaking down of the melodic aspects as well as much of the connections with other components of the arrangement; was hoping a bit more out of the whole verse-chorus pattern but this is still very well thought out especially with much of the breaks that came in-between. In terms of standing alone it works well if you want a good groove to go into; may not fit everyone's tastes depending on genre passion but it has still got some very firm material granted around it through its establishments alone. In all honesty this is one of the more liberal incarnations out of the mixes I've witnessed from Ziwtra, but it was well crafted to keep things interesting nonetheless.

Creativity

I managed to detect a lot of fresh areas after the second permutation of the theme (2:36) and it's there that I appreciated a lot of the thought that came through with much of the progressions at hand. Even here the melody's been played around a fair amount and with a firm and lively atmosphere to maintain the audience's interest. For much of the time the segments link together rather well for what they were, especially for a track like this; although I was hoping for some of the later portions to end up with a more dynamic emphasis a la what was shown in "Rain in Chicago". I can tell that much of its pulse has done well to adapt well to those who want something with a groove to listen to, so for some it can be fresh on that aspects. Some of the melodic sections could moderately tire out especially with some of the main riff as shown upon the flute throughout the mix, but that's alright. There's not much repetition so to speak of, although if anything I'd point at the bass; could do with some variance in rhythm in parts to make that stick out a bit more, although it still felt rather thoughtful in keeping the pulse intact. As a whole I can say it's enjoyable if you're into the genre, although even if you're not it’s still be worth a shot and you may even get a kick out of it if you've played the game.

Production

The samples are generally alright in their execution; a bit trebly in some parts but they're still well chosen. I weren't too down with some of the orchestrated elements most notably the violin that came in later, and I wasn't too sure about the choice of bass for what it was, although I really appreciate much of the synth pad and lead patches for what they were. Going back to the treble-like EQs it would help to space them out a fair amount, with an increase in low-end frequencies granted to sounds like the bass (obviously), some mid-frequencies towards some of the mid-range spectrum and further attention to instruments like the flute and violin to make them sound a bit crisper if required. The overall encoding was very sharp for what it was; I found much of the drum sampling (given that it sounded the same almost all the way through) to be very strong in its own right to help emphasize on the track quality. The sound levels are very loud and brash; not quite the most dynamic that the user may adapt to but they've still got their moments to be able to match up to on that field. The panning is shown to be a bit dependant on the right hand speaker so it should help to have just as much going on at the other side; mind you as a whole I saw a fair amount of action right across the instrumentation, instantly defining them for what they were. In terms of the technical aspect I can't see this as one of Ziwtra's better works but it's definitely slick enough for what it was and should be worth noting interest.

Having looked back at the judges decisions I feel that much of my qualms relating to the track are similar to Liontamer's on the quirk on that I've heard some much better production work from Ziwtra. But even with that into mind the overall arrangement, although a little bit over-liberal in parts, was still very cool and expansive for even source material like this one.

So yeah, it's not the hottest of Ziwtra works the site has on offer but it's still a goodie if you want to see some slick quality Terranigma coverage. It was worthy of my time and it can be of yours too if you're a fan of the game/genre/musician. Hope to see more work from this user in the future!

----"The original is in 6/4 or 7/4 or some weird time signature and it took a lot of manhandling of the material to get it into the 4/4 breakbeat form it's in now. Other than that... this isn't a personal favorite, but I really do like that flute at the beginning. And the weird guitar sound. I guess I am not so happy with this mix because I used so many gimmicks that I have used in the past... other than the musical challenge of changing time signatures and adapting the song, I felt I didn't break any new ground or improve in any way. Oh well."

Erm, the song is in 3. 6 would be a multiple of 3, and would allow you to 'do it in 2' with some difficulty. The melody is obviously at first subdivided into 9 measure phrases in which later changes.

DOnt get me wrong, bt the song is cool, but it's not "some weird time signature". If you want a really good example of a "weird T/S", go look at Final Fantasy 6 "Another World of Beasts". fun 7/8 time signature to play with.

It could be worse.. I played for a marching band a song with 4/4, 3/4, 5/8, 7/8 in it. It was by Richard Melilo and the name of the piece was "Timestorm". That was a beautiful number Just picture marching in a fast 4 whilst playing 5/8 and 7/8 stuff. ;P

You are gravely mistaken my friend. Read my first post

EDIT: This is in response to what's written below.

Please say you're joking. So you're telling me that to determine the time signature.... you add up the total number of beats in a section and then see which small numbers go into it evenly? That makes no sense.... Do that for rite of spring and maybe it's in 4/4 for all we know.

Gravely mistaken? Really?

Has it ever occured to you that if you attempt to transcribe a work, you must attack a time signature to it?

There is no exact signature to attach to every work, as you could easily use factors to change it (say, a fast 4/4 to a medium 2/2). Unlike what you seem to say, you CAN atempt a profile of a song by

1: Counting lead beats for getting a rough beats per minute.

2: 'Feeling how long a phrase is'.

This reminds me of when someone made the outrageous claim that "hey ya" was in eleven.... since it is 3 Bars of 4/4 one bar of 2/4 and then 2 bars of 4/4. In total that makes 22 Quarter notes.... 22 is a multiple of 11 therefore it must be 11!! I honestly saw someone make this claim

And yet you assume that I am the same. I am not.

Take a look at a Bartok Score. You'll notice that the time signature varies almost like every bar. This is because time signatures are used to show the listener/performers where one is supposed to be.

Yeah. Bartok. From the same craptacular lines of Chopan and their ilk. I hate having to count 120 bars for my parts to come in. On the opposing side, playing Gershwin pieces, like Rhapsody in Blue are fun.

And BTW, I've even had directors 'shit their pants' on stage over how the pianist plays these non-time signature songs. Of course, I bet you have no real concert practice, eh?

In Zue the location of one [first downbeat] is constantly varying[not just in the bassline but in the drums and organ as well] that means the time signature is adjusting.

Im talking about the source material, the SPC ripped from the game via zsnes sound extract. I then can import it via a tool to a Impulse Tracker and open it in ModPlug Tracker. After doing that, the base beats Im looking at channel 2 and 8. Channel 8 has subdivided notes (at 2x speed of the first 3 beats).

By your logic 7+7+7+6+7+7+7+6+6+6+7+7+7+6+7+7+7+6+6+6+6+6+6 = 144

So that means Zue could be 48 bars of 3

36 bars of 4, or 12 bars of 12.... Do you understand why this line of reasoning makes absolutely no sense?

I do, but evidently, you do not. In reality, depending what you play, 2, 3, 4, and 6 are all compatible. 2, 3, and 6 could all be used in a valse like Valse de Fleurs (Nutcracker). Just this last winter, I played that very solo. The song under our director, was conducted in a slow-ish 1, but my score is in 3. That specific solo is rolling upwards eighths, so counting 6 is possible.

A question to you would be the following: What is the proper time signature for a song that is in 3/4, and has an excess of dotted quarters?

I beg you to listen very carefully to Zue and while you do so Try counting 1,2,3 over and over during the whole song.... see how ritarded that sounds.. and then get back to me. Ocassionally you will come out at the right place but for the most part it will sound wrong.

I did it, and the rythym does not ritard, but I've to question who exactly that 'ritard' is.

I would really like to know what experience you have in transcribing and composing. And no, I do not mean djng or other new-age crap. I mean real music work.

I find it hillarious that the song you spoke of is called Timestorm when it deals with such laughably simple time signatures.

Are you some sort of idiot? SO, according to you, every 4/4 time signature song is childs play? Well, I guess it is to you, if you create audio excrement.

I admit I come off a bit arrogant in my above statements but they are true none the less.

True, hardly. Places that deal in audio have this 'golden ear' syndrome. Whether people argue about types of wiring (gold vs copper vs material of the day) or headsets, or speakers, or whatever, it always is the "Im always right, youre always wrong" mentality. Perhaps, you might try backing up with your proof, and not try to divert attention on piano concertos.

Edit Number 2 in response to Sad pickle.

Ok now we've just about entered the twilight zone as far as I can tell. YOU'RE COUNTING SUBDIVISIONS!!!!!!

If you count in 16th notes then there will always be four of them for every beat. EVERY SONG EVER WRITTEN [as long as it's not swing-time] can be counted one-two-three-four because individual beats can always be subdivided into four [unless it's swing]This has absolutely nothing to do with time-signatures. Okay thank you!

What do you think "beats" are? Oh yeah, they dont subdivide anything, right? Guess what, without subdividing, you'd end up with every song in 1 and that 1 would be the length of the song. Yeah, that sounds silly, but that'd be the truth.

You are gravely mistaken my friend. Read my first post

Explain to me why Im "gravely mistaken".

The song is obviously in 3, no matter if the baseline is in a faux-7 and 6. The first 2 phrases of this song are in 27 beats (or 9 measures of 3) if you do not count the leading 3 beats.

It's in 4/4, which is pretty easy to hear right from getgo. Chant it quickly. "onetwothreefouronetwothreefour". What are we arguing about here?

You are gravely mistaken my friend. Read my first post

Explain to me why Im "gravely mistaken".

The song is obviously in 3, no matter if the baseline is in a faux-7 and 6. The first 2 phrases of this song are in 27 beats (or 9 measures of 3) if you do not count the leading 3 beats.

Edit 3:

Okay now I'm sort of lost. Why are you insulting my composing? You might be a genius musician Krale. Seriously you could be a brilliant composer/performer.... I'm not saying any thing about that. I'm just saying you're confused about the issue of time signature.

The reason I'm arguing about that is because I want people to apreciate what a master piece Zue [the original] is and you are down playing it.

As for my performing experience/composing/schooling I have sent you a private message concerning it since I don't think that belongs in the forum [and it does not help prove my point about ZUE]

I'm just fanatical about Miyoko Kobayashi and I hate to see her misrepresented.

PS: Who is Chopan.... I have never heard of this person. Is he at all connected to the polish composer Chopin??? Ok that was too far... but I couldn't help myself.

PPS: I was using the slang term ritarded meaning mentally handicapped. I was basically saying it would sound stupid. I was not talking about slowing the tempo

----"The original is in 6/4 or 7/4 or some weird time signature and it took a lot of manhandling of the material to get it into the 4/4 breakbeat form it's in now. Other than that... this isn't a personal favorite, but I really do like that flute at the beginning. And the weird guitar sound. I guess I am not so happy with this mix because I used so many gimmicks that I have used in the past... other than the musical challenge of changing time signatures and adapting the song, I felt I didn't break any new ground or improve in any way. Oh well."

Erm, the song is in 3. 6 would be a multiple of 3, and would allow you to 'do it in 2' with some difficulty. The melody is obviously at first subdivided into 9 measure phrases in which later changes.

DOnt get me wrong, bt the song is cool, but it's not "some weird time signature". If you want a really good example of a "weird T/S", go look at Final Fantasy 6 "Another World of Beasts". fun 7/8 time signature to play with.

It could be worse.. I played for a marching band a song with 4/4, 3/4, 5/8, 7/8 in it. It was by Richard Melilo and the name of the piece was "Timestorm". That was a beautiful number Just picture marching in a fast 4 whilst playing 5/8 and 7/8 stuff. ;P